Re: Upgrading from 10.0 to 10.1

[Stephen Borrill <netbsd%precedence.co.uk@localhost>]

On Wed, 1 Oct 2025, Liam Proven wrote:
> I think I messed this up.

Sorry you've had a hard time.

> It has taken me several years of practice and exploring in VMs to be
> able to get NetBSD installed on the bare metal in a multiboot setup.
>
> This was the result of my first explorations:
> https://www.theregister.com/2022/08/10/netbsd_93/
>
> This mentions my hardware spec for installing 10:
> https://www.theregister.com/2024/04/17/30yo_netbsd_releases_v10/
>
> I Googled for info on how to upgrade. I didn't find much and the info
> was conflicting or not completely applicable.
>
> The only thing I found re 10.0 to 10.1 was this:
>
> https://www.ncartron.org/upgrading-netbsd-to-101.html
>
> I also read this chapter closely:
>
> https://www.netbsd.org/docs/guide/en/chap-upgrading.html
>
> I found this confusing and unhelpful.
>
> 1. There are two different methods described. It does not clearly
> explain the differences, or give any recommendations about which to
> prefer or why. Speaking as a (former) professional technical author
> for enterprise Linux distributions among other things, when explaining
> different tools that do the same thing, it is _necessary_ to explain
> _why_ there are two and how to choose.

Agreed. While I've never used either method, the sequence of steps 
for upgrading a major release with sysupgrade explains what needs 
to be done:

1) download and extract kernel
2) download and extract modules
3) reboot
- you are now running the new release kernel with backwards compatibility 
allowing you to continue with an older userland

4) download and extract at least all the sets you had installed (if in 
doubt, look in /etc/mtree). You should download etc and xetc, but MUST 
not extract them. You can add other sets (e.g. X) if you want
5) run etcupdate (which I've never bothered with)
6) run postinstall -s etc.tar.xz -s xetc.tar.xz fix
7) reboot

> 2. The `sysinst` method does not explain what it will upgrade. The
> tool offers choices but does not explain what the choices mean.
>
> For example:
>
> «
> Figure 4.6. Choosing the distribution filesets
> »
>
> Surely if one is upgrading then what it upgrades is what is presently
> installed? You can't upgrade something which is not there to upgrade.
> But the menu options here suggested to me that I should pick full
> install regardless of what was already installed, and that might
> install a lot of extra things I did not have and fill my root
> partition.

As above, upgrading is not dissimilar to a new installation except you 
don't extract etc and xetc. Those are handled by etxupdate and 
postinstall.

When upgrading, sysinst should check what is installed by looking in 
/etc/mtree and suggesting accordingly - I don't know whether it does 
though.

> I was not sure what to do.
>
> I tried anyway. It ran for a long time -- hours -- and at the end I
> was still on 10.0.

That sounds like a kernel was missed.

> I moved on to the other method described.
>
> 3. The `sysupgrade` tool section contains scary warnings about the
> necessity of doing some components before other components, but does
> not then clearly explain how to do which first and how to check.
>
> It also says there is an `auto` option and recommends it. It does not
> specify if the `auto` option will do things in the correct order for
> you.

Yes, the docs for sysupgrade are very unclear about what auto does.

> The config files provided seemed to be incorrect, and although I was
> running a clean install of 10.0 the config files contained mentions of
> 9.2 and other obsolete versions I never ran on this hardware. Why?
> This seems like a bug to me.

Remember that sysupgrade is not a core part of NetBSD. It is a pkgsrc 
package and upgrading pkgsrc package is outside the scope of an OS 
upgrade. It is therefore possible that you have an old version of 
sysupgrade installed (and/or a modified configuration file which would not 
be replaced as part of an upgrade of it).

This is unlike OpenBSD where the upgrade tool is in base, so will get 
upgraded with the OS. The nearest comparision is etcupdate and postinstall 
which are in base and so are upgraded with the OS. That's why I use those.

> The examples in the manual are also for obsolete releases and have not
> been updated. That seems like an oversight to me.
>
> Anyway, I edited the config file, attempting to specify 10.1, and ran
>
> `sysupgrade auto`
>
> It did a lot of work. I left it overnight.
>
> In the morning it said it was done.
>
> I rebooted.
>
> I can no longer log in.
>
> It starts to the graphical login screen. None of my credentials are accepted.
>
> "Login incorrect or forbidden by policy."
>
> At a text console, it says much the same:
>
> "Login incorrect or refused on this terminal."
>
> I guess I am stuck with reinstalling?

As you can boot single-user, we can have a go at working out what has 
gone wrong with sysupgrade. As I say, I've never used etcupdate and it 
will be this that has messed up the settings (or if it interactively 
asked something, the wrong answer was given).

> What is the _best_ way to upgrade a running system from a stable
> release to the following one, when a new release arrives? Best as in
> safest, easiest, least room for error, requiring the least expertise?

The steps I give at the top are fool-proof for a given class of fool :-)

> In contrast at the same time I upgraded OpenBSD 7.6 to 7.7.
>
> 1. I used pkg_add to upgrade all packages.
> 2. I used `sysupgrade` to do the kernel and base OS.
>
> As far as I can tell it does not matter which way round you do this,
> but I knew #2 meant a reboot so I wanted to do the bit that didn't
> need a reboot first.

With NetBSD you definitely want to upgrade the OS first and then the 
packages. I can't see it would be a good idea any other way around as we 
have backwards compatibility for older pkgsrc, but not forward 
compatibility for pkgs for an unknown future release.

--
Stephen