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Thanks for getting back to me!
I'm not really a new user to HP300; I used NetBSD on a few HP9000/340s pretty heavily a few decades ago. I set up netbooting once way back for the experience/novelty, but pretty quickly figured out that running these machines diskless was pretty painful and
SCSI disks were relatively plentiful.
I was given this 360 many years ago (probably not a 362 as indicated earlier), but never put it to use and it sat in my closet (along with a stack of other hp300s) for many years. But I'm building a computer museum in my office at work, and I've decided I
want to get this machine running as representative of Unix minicomputers of the day. Also, it seemed like a fun project.
But I've long lost my boot drives of yesteryear, and I can't find anything SCSI in my stash (or, for that matter, an enclosure). And my lone HPIB drive seems to be non-responsive. So I'm trying the netbooting thing as a bootstrap process, to get enough OS
on the machine to then disklabel & install an OS on a SCSI drive, once I procure one.
Anyhow, enough backstory.
Regarding carrier lost:
My 10base2 networking consists of a noname 10baseT hub connected via cat5 to the raspberry pi and a single 10base2 BNC port, a couple T's and terminators, and an approximately 1 meter long length of RG58. And, of course, the 360 on one of the Ts. I checked
the resistance on the terminators and, although they say 50 ohms, read out at about 30 & 38 ohms. Not sure if that would be enough of a problem (also, do resistors decay over time?). The cabling and assorted connectors look fine; no obvious oxides on the
connectors and no kinks in the wire (and I used two separate lengths in different tests), and while I haven't used this particular hub in many years, it seems to work fine otherwise. I may have a spare system interface board I could swap in, in case it's
the onboard ethernet that's causing a problem. I can also check if there's an AUI port on either. I'm 93.7% sure neither does (or I would have used that) but it's possible I completely overlooked it. But overall, my cabling looks fine. Of course, looks
can be deceiving, and I don't have enough 10base2 stuff lying around anymore to do proper testing.
I looked to see if there were any direct 10base2 to 10baseT gadgets out there, and the answer is...no really. On ebay there's a handful of them, but they're all in the $100 & up range. That's more than I'm willing to take a gamble on to see if it might solve
the problem. Pretty much it looks like 10base2 stuff is non-existent these days, which really limits the overall potential uptake of these machines. Maybe someone needs to make a 10base2 shield for the raspberry pi! An alternative might be to buy a $5 8
bit network interface off ebay and build the most minimal i386 netbsd server ever...
Regarding my server setup: I see that you say that the kernel is delivered via nfs. Does that mean there's no need for tftp at all? I may have needlessly gone down that rabbit hole as well, and I need to get nfs going to get the kernel over. I knew I needed to get nfs running; I just figured I'd address that after I got the kernel delivered.
Also. Regarding the network + nfs:
I have an AUI port on my machine (in an expansion card), and when I use that rather than the I am able to successfully get to the point where it keeps asking over and over for the different netbsd kernels, over & over (as opposed to using thinnet, where it
just hangs on the le0a carrier lost errors). Can I use the AUI port to deliver the kernel (and the rest of the filesystem) via nfs? ChatGPT claimed that the SYS_UBOOT bootstrap loader would only work on the thinnet network connection...but was it hallucinating
on this?
As an aside, ChatGPT suggested that Version D ROMs would allow the bootloader to select other LAN interfaces. Also, totally a hallucination? I believe I have Version C ROMs, by the way.
Totally unrelated:
I found in my stash a video board for which I have no idea what monitors it drives. It's not a bunch of BNC connectors, but a 9-pin connector. I don't have the model number on me right now, but when I looked for it on the intertubes I the only reference I
could find referred to it as a monochrome graphics framebuffer. Does this right a bell for anyone? I wonder if this is used to drive an early PC MGA or CGA monitor, or one of the touchscreen monitors that HP was selling. I can get the model number later
this evening.
Thanks again,
-mike
From: Izumi Tsutsui <tsutsui%ceres.dti.ne.jp@localhost>
Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2025 5:07 AM To: Mike Begley <spam%hell.org@localhost> Cc: port-hp300%NetBSD.org@localhost <port-hp300%NetBSD.org@localhost>; tsutsui%ceres.dti.ne.jp@localhost <tsutsui%ceres.dti.ne.jp@localhost> Subject: Re: Difficulty with netbooting - le0: lost carrier when bringing down thenetbsd kernel Hi,
> For literally the first time in at least a couple decades, I'm > trying to power up and play with my 9000/362 (I think that would > be the designation based on what I have). I'm glad to see a new user trying NetBSD/hp300 :-) > A bit of hardware background. My machine has the thinnet NIC on > the System Interface board, and an AUI interface in the expansion > chassis. Because immediate access to AUI networking was a little > easier (just grab a tranceiver and I'm ready to go), I decided to > use the AUI. I switched the select codes on both ethernet devices > so that the AUI had the lowest number (not sure if this is necessary). The internal LANCE Ethernet board have AUI interface (at least on my 362 and 382), but I guess your machine doesn't have AUI cable and connector? https://gist.github.com/tsutsui/98ffed5534af93fd21bfdfee43d92187 > Main useful observation: the console message was saying that the > SYS_UBOOT bootstrapper was using bootp, and that rarpd was no > longer in use. Interesting (if true). Ah, yes, in old days NetBSD bootloaders (and kernels) used rarp + bootparamd as the Sun machines, but at some point we have switched to use BOOTP (since 2001) and then DHCP (2014) by default. https://github.com/NetBSD/src/commit/fa9aa504f9fb5e767443b47a47ae224279eb5cb8 https://github.com/NetBSD/src/commit/64e71305842d249807b86b0960838b90ffba811f The whole netboot page needs to be updated, but IIRC install note https://cdn.netbsd.org/pub/NetBSD/NetBSD-10.1/hp300/INSTALL.html has more updated info. > I download and configure dnsmasq. This took a bit of poking, > but I eventually got it set up in a way that seemed sane. > On the 300, the bootstrap would start up, and then start asking > for a variety of kernels (netbsd, netbsd.gz, etc) but never actually > got any data. It just loops over and over through the series of > kernel names. Using tcpdump on the tftp port, I see no requests > from the hp. Coding buddy suggests that the SYS_UBOOT might insist > on using the thinnet NIC, regardless of Select Code or how it > brought down the bootstrap. At that point I break for the night. The bootstrap sequense is: - the firmware uses rbootd protocol to load a bootloader from a server - the bootloader uses BOOTP/DHCP to get IP addresses of server and client - the bootloader also tries to mount servers directory using NFS - the bootloader loads the specified kernel from the NFS server So you might need more NFS settings. Furthermore, if you might need to configure your DHCP server to assign fixed IP address for your hp300, to proper NFS export settings. > This morning, I dug up some thinnet hardware & cabling, and switched > everything over to use that NIC. Now, I actually see requests for a > kernel showing up in the dnsmasq logs: : > and on the HP console I just see a sequence of errors: > le0: lost carrier > le0: lost carrier > le0: lost carrier > le0: lost carrier > bootp: no reply > boot: client IP address: 0.0.0.0 > root: addr=0.0.0.0 path= > le0: lost carrier > le0: lost carrier > le0: lost carrier > le0: lost carrier > arpwhohas: no response for 0.0.0.0 : > And that's where I'm stuck. I suspect those messages indicate > physical level errors; e.g. the onboard bnc wiring, 10baseT hub > I'm using that has a 10base2 connector on it is faulty, or more > likely, the rg58 cabling/tees/terminators have decayed or oxidized > over the decades and are no longer reliable. It's likely, "lost carrier" could be caused by cable or HUB issue. > - Ideas on what I might be doing wrong? I know I'm straying from > the standard path, but out of what seems like necessity. I could > try to go back to traditional bootp, but that doesn't seem like > it would make a difference. It's the tftp part that's failing. > - Ideas on how to do this all over the AUI, which seems like it > might be a more reliable connection. As I wrote above you need to setup NFS server. I have not confirmed netboot page information is up to date, https://www.netbsd.org/docs/network/netboot/nfs.html but installation manual also has similar description: https://cdn.netbsd.org/pub/NetBSD/NetBSD-10.1/hp300/INSTALL.html#Configuring%20the%20netboot%20server > - Have you used the hp300 netboot instructions lately as published > on the NetBSD site, and been successful, or found another path? I have >10 hp300 machines that use netboot (for kernel debugging etc.) including 10base-2 via a hub, but I'm also using NetBSD/i386 server, so there might be several quirks on Linux NFS server, especially I'm afraid it doesn't support old NFSv2. (Of course bad default (rarap/bootparamd) should be fixed on netboot pages) Here is a boot log of my HP362: --- Self-Test Mode Copyright 1991, Hewlett-Packard Company. All Rights Reserved. BOOTROM Rev. 3.11 19 NOV 91 MC68030 Processor MC68882 Coprocessor Configuration EEPROM HP-HIL RESET To Restart Loading Memory Self-Test Mode HP-IB DMA-C0 Testing Memory Self-Test Mode RAM 16776874 Bytes HP98644 (RS-232) at 9 HP PARALLEL at 12 HP98265 (SCSI S 32) at 14 HP98643 (LAN) at 21, AUI, 080009F25E70 Bit Mapped Video at 132 (Console) System Search Mode :LAN, 21, 00E04C680238 mirage 1Z SYS_UBOOT Booting System >> NetBSD/hp300 Primary Boot, Revision 1.22 (Sat May 31 17:00:41 UTC 2025) (from NetBSD 10.99.14) >> HP 9000/362 SPU >> Enter "reset" to reset system. Boot: [[[le0a:]netbsd][-a][-c][-d][-s][-v][-q]] :- netbsd -s boot: client IP address: 192.168.20.49 root addr=192.168.20.1 path=/r/export/NetBSD/hp300/root 3022420+131276 [386800+258068]=0x39fa44 Start @ 0xff003000 [1=0xff303f20-0x39fa44]... Entry point: 0xff003000 [ 1.0000000] bootinfo found at 0xff002000 [ 1.0000000] Copyright (c) 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, [ 1.0000000] 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, [ 1.0000000] 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023, [ 1.0000000] 2024, 2025 [ 1.0000000] The NetBSD Foundation, Inc. All rights reserved. [ 1.0000000] Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 [ 1.0000000] The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. [ 1.0000000] NetBSD 11.99.4 (GENERIC) #154: Wed Nov 26 17:58:47 JST 2025 [ 1.0000000] tsutsui@mirage:/s/cvs/src/sys/arch/hp300/compile/GENERIC [ 1.0000000] HP 9000/362 (25MHz MC68030 CPU+MMU, 25MHz MC68882 FPU) [ 1.0000000] total memory = 16372 KB [ 1.0000000] avail memory = 11592 KB [ 1.0000000] mainbus0 (root) [ 1.0000000] intio0 at mainbus0 [ 1.0000000] rtc0 at intio0 addr 0x420000 [ 1.0000000] hil0 at intio0 addr 0x428000 ipl 1 [ 1.0000000] nhpib1 at intio0 addr 0x478000 ipl 3: internal HP-IB [ 1.0000000] hpibbus1 at nhpib1 [ 1.0000000] dma0 at intio0 addr 0x500000 ipl 1: 98620C, 2 channels, 32-bit DMA [ 1.0000000] dio0 at mainbus0 [ 1.0000000] com0 at dio0 scode 9 ipl 5: ns16550a, 16-byte FIFO [ 1.0000000] com0: console [ 1.0000000] internal parallel at dio0 scode 12 ipl 3 not configured [ 1.0000000] spc0 at dio0 scode 14 ipl 4: 98265A SCSI, 32-bit DMA, SCSI ID 7 [ 1.0000000] scsibus0 at spc0: 8 targets, 8 luns per target [ 1.0000000] le0 at dio0 scode 21 ipl 5: address 08:00:09:f2:5e:70 [ 1.0000000] le0: 8 receive buffers, 2 transmit buffers [ 1.0000000] sti0 at dio0 scode 132 ipl 3: rev 8.02;193, ID 0x27134CB440A00499 [ 1.0000000] sti0: 362V, 2048x512 frame buffer, 640x480x8 display [ 1.0000000] sti0: 8x16 font type 1, 16 bpc, charset 0-255 [ 1.0000000] sti0: Enable mmap support [ 1.0000000] wsdisplay0 at sti0 kbdmux 1 [ 1.0000000] WARNING: system needs entropy for security; see entropy(7) [ 1.0359910] scsibus0: waiting 2 seconds for devices to settle... [ 2.2654110] hil0: no devices [ 4.9943590] sd0 at scsibus0 target 0 lun 0: <NEC, DKU374, 441C> disk fixed [ 5.0443470] sd0: 2049 MB, 3045 cyl, 16 head, 86 sec, 512 bytes/sect x 4197520 sectors [ 5.0743430] sd0: async, 8-bit transfers [ 5.0943110] sd1 at scsibus0 target 1 lun 0: <TEAC, FC-1 HF 07, RV B> disk removable [ 5.2142710] sd1(spc0:0:1:0): not ready, data = "" 00 00 00 04 00 00 00 [ 5.2743750] sd1: drive offline [ 5.3042670] sd1: async, 8-bit transfers [ 5.8140310] swwdog0: software watchdog initialized [ 6.4835110] boot device: le0 [ 6.4936710] root on le0 [ 6.5077070] nfs_boot: trying DHCP/BOOTP [ 9.5622910] nfs_boot: DHCP next-server: 192.168.20.1 [ 9.5803270] nfs_boot: my_domain=ceres.dti.ne.jp [ 9.5844670] nfs_boot: my_addr=192.168.20.49 [ 9.5943190] nfs_boot: my_mask=255.255.255.0 [ 9.6042630] nfs_boot: gateway=192.168.20.1 [ 15.7598630] root on mirage:/r/export/NetBSD/hp300/root [ 15.7761030] root file system type: nfs [ 15.7808230] kern.module.path=/stand/hp300/11.99.4/modules [ 15.8297710] WARNING: clock lost 45 days [ 15.8497630] WARNING: using filesystem time [ 15.8684790] WARNING: CHECK AND RESET THE DATE! [ 21.7676350] entropy: best effort Enter pathname of shell or RETURN for /bin/sh: We recommend that you create a non-root account and use su(1) for root access. # --- Thanks, --- Izumi Tsutsui |