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Hash: SHA1

On Friday 25 March 2005 08:54, Igor Sobrado wrote:
> My suggestion is replacing bc(1), dc(1), and the diffutils commands
> diff(1) and diff3(1) with the OpenBSD ones. =A0sdiff(1) has no
> replacement yet, though. =A0I do not know if this command is "required",
> if it can be easily replaced, or if it must stay as is.=20

I'll speak to bc(1) and dc(1).   (In case you don't get to the end of this=
=20
e-mail, I don't think OpenBSD bc and dc are good replacements for GNU bc an=
d=20
dc.)

> It is not a=20
> licensing issue; in my humble opinion, there are good technical reasons

Good.  I like technical discussions. =20

> (i.e., better end-user documentation, clean and well written source code,
> and better integration with the operating system source tree) for
> importing these commands from OpenBSD:
>
> =A0 - Man pages are better written in the OpenBSD versions of those
> =A0 =A0 commands. =A0NetBSD currently only offers a list of options
> =A0 =A0 available for these commands:
>...
> =A0 =A0 These man pages are much better and describe the behaviour of the
> =A0 =A0 commands, instead of providing a list of options without even a
> =A0 =A0 brief description of the commands.
>...
> =A0 - Source code is well written and can be easily integrated in the
> =A0 =A0 NetBSD source tree (e.g., src/gnu/dist/diffutils/diffutils2netbsd
> =A0 =A0 is not required).

Since I haven't investigated OpenBSD's bc(1) and dc(1) for a while, I thoug=
ht=20
I'd check them out again.  So I checked out the current versions from an=20
anoncvs site and got them running on NetBSD-2.0 (i386, 3.2Ghz machine).

Let me look at the points one by one:

a) better end-user documentation:

=2D ---->~/OpenBSD/src/usr.bin/bc
nooksack[247]$ uname -a
NetBSD nooksack 2.0 NetBSD 2.0 (NOOKSACK.MP) #1: Mon Dec 20 17:16:15 PST 20=
04 =20
phil@nooksack:/home/phil/nb-2.0/src/sys/arch/i386/compile/NOOKSACK.MP i386

=2D ---->~/OpenBSD/src/usr.bin/bc
nooksack[248]$ wc -l bc.cat1 /usr/share/man/cat1/bc.0=20
     237 bc.cat1
     799 /usr/share/man/cat1/bc.0
    1036 total

=2D ---->~/OpenBSD/src/usr.bin/bc
nooksack[249]$ wc -l ../dc/dc.cat1 /usr/share/man/cat1/dc.0
     333 ../dc/dc.cat1
     294 /usr/share/man/cat1/dc.0
     627 total

Well, for the bc manual, the current (GNU) one has 799 lines versus 237 for=
=20
OpenBSD.  The GNU version is a much more comprehensive description of the=20
POSIX bc language with the GNU extensions.   All command line switches are=
=20
documented in full although they appear a little further down in the manual=
=20
than the OpenBSD version.  In fact, most current bug reports for GNU bc are=
=20
features documented in the manual page.

=46or the dc manual, the OpenBSD version has a few more lines than the GNU=
=20
version.  Again, all command line switches are documented.

b) well written source code

This is a hard thing to quantify.  What specifically about the GNU version =
is=20
not "well written source code"?

If you are talking about the methodology .... in that GNU bc is a complete=
=20
product not requiring GNU dc as a backend, that was a design decision.  I=20
wouldn't necessarily call one version superior to the other.  (OpenBSD bc=20
uses the original design of having bc being a preprocessor for dc.)

c) better integration with the operating system source tree

I don't see how it is "better".   With OpenBSD bc, dc you have the following
trees to compile bc and dc.
  src/usr.bin/bc
  src/usr.bin/dc
  src/crypto/dist/openssl
  src/lib/libcrypto  (reachover makefiles)

=46or GNU bc:
   src/gnu/dist/bc
   src/gnu/usr.bin/bc  (reachover makefiles)
   src/gnu/usr.bin/dc  (reachover makefiles)

d) Although not mentioned in the original post, for me the real technical=20
issue is how does the product perform in use. The following are time tests =
on=20
a variety of operations.  It is targetting the most expensive operations in=
=20
bc(1).   First, it checks out the math library and then looks at things lik=
e=20
multiplication, division, raising and square root.   As you will see, GNU b=
c=20
outperforms OpenBSD in many of the tests and some cases, OpenBSD can't even=
=20
do what GNU bc does.   In 2 cases below, I killed OpenBSD dc after it ran f=
or=20
10 or more minutes of CPU time. (time reports ' Command terminated=20
abnormally.' in these cases.)

Each of the tests listed below are quite simple.  For example, the "exp.b"=
=20
test is:
     for (a=3D0; a<180; a+=3D.4) x=3De(a)
     x
     quit

The one for fact.b is:
    define f (x) {

      if (x<=3D1) return(1)
      return (f(x-1)*x)
    }

    for (a=3D1; a<600; a++) b=3Df(a)
    "
    "
    "b=3D";b
    quit

If anyone wants the full source code for these tests, just let me know and=
=20
I'll send them.=20

The quick analysis:

   GNU bc is faster on all tested operations except raise and square root. =
  =20
There are 4 tests in which I killed OpenBSD dc because of excessive time us=
e=20
(10 or more cpu minutes) or OpenBSD dc reported an error.  Here is the test=
=20
data taken on NetBSD-2.0/i386, 3.2 Ghz processor.

Timing exp.b with /usr/bin/bc
99836408603283573660347145562829683495827909199408566065153345558783\
9427595471.89114392327665123852
        1.38 real         1.38 user         0.00 sys
Timing exp.b with openbc
time: Command terminated abnormally.
      713.47 real       713.15 user         0.01 sys
Timing ln.b with /usr/bin/bc
87.336544750553108986571247303730247577513016929392162019205681
        0.83 real         0.83 user         0.00 sys
Timing ln.b with openbc
87.336544750553108986571247303730247577513016929392162019205681
        1.62 real         1.61 user         0.00 sys
Timing sine.b with /usr/bin/bc
=2D -.00318530179313823899
=2E11677468864383377454
        0.47 real         0.47 user         0.00 sys
Timing sine.b with openbc
dc: allocation failure 306a041: Cannot allocate memory
      153.50 real       152.37 user         1.03 sys
Timing atan.b with /usr/bin/bc
1.56979432312222174523
1.10514068836449430089
        0.39 real         0.39 user         0.00 sys
Timing atan.b with openbc
time: Command terminated abnormally.
     1208.93 real      1207.27 user         1.29 sys
Timing jn.b with /usr/bin/bc
=2D -.03329855487630566800748309439984550659781158351287
=2D -.00648115168876276895858580295786734310987910950934
=2E04431532933245365649911092813736180550142494873120
=2D -.04084340882273173036919689349257616993289838931589
=2D -.02243471758440192810060521803721671199059663161876
=2D -.01449122706478569886133684583938086724345975237695
        2.60 real         2.57 user         0.00 sys
Timing jn.b with openbc
=2D -.03329855487630566800748309439984550659781158351287
=2D -.00648115168876276895858580295786734310987910950934
=2E04431532933245365649911092813736180550142494873120
=2D -.04084340882273173036919689349257616993289838931589
=2D -.02243471758440192810060521803721671199059663161876
=2D -.01449122706478569886133684583938086724345975237695
        6.49 real         6.45 user         0.00 sys
Timing mul.b with /usr/bin/bc
989901
99990000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000009899\
01
       16.57 real        16.55 user         0.00 sys
Timing mul.b with openbc
989901
999900000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000098990\
1
       65.31 real        65.28 user         0.01 sys
Timing div.b with /usr/bin/bc
=2E00673400673400673400
        0.94 real         0.94 user         0.00 sys
Timing div.b with openbc
=2E00673400673400673400
        7.02 real         7.00 user         0.00 sys
Timing raise.b with /usr/bin/bc
53575430359313366047421252453000090528070240585276680372187519418517\
55255624680612465991894078479290637973364587765734125935726428461570\
21799228878734928740196728388741211549271053730253118557093897709107\
65232374917909706336993837795827719730385314572855982388432710838302\
14915826312193418602834034688
39697977041703362615702678709305122462681530702224642254286133515337\
31121714114309754588503336212025686074161442928659336003723071405914\
78848309822561772383839710350584896402220373001190703774258026510405\
27518908582589655504563827122203780286546777023035590309240593409668\
69137901091424431353289505138979850305115020976293661232053488318167\
79935708174993361590664792773908423073338249604577729940439261369358\
65478036617156669490258918829886048556045298030238322029323340811255\
20845879120953286975542359721164595802152529610676909754197999860513\
42883667200105872742751075034089207703494137083260853367392970363943\
41058871876000227208704775002987488655929852802383563178783015515132\
73802329331710120199946608626679842589682979501211611219605524232607\
38170592605503539197410282416898007746291043901035579521458794692642\
48095404881495601917677444037454419569756094580882148530080910044836\
54204172783575243210835542017203441241479833069304727219080812180660\
61477505556612995849510456463190968469262942507179417505392513760485\
82221529594262952468329102882030526749622378051614019442705264354067\
04735233734740039512358316847571547804037031697658017680982374654808\
30092198611119307860788645659987338236486276174963970900955043741546\
26161909977218927209704136489762497300323905180683834881760897951819\
22674970092978302035723143736992881378782316581701386853550196072799\
65283732902707959883427924858550575683591721132186405856969452926737\
522979546238293455470440113909966583394150131060667
12996011362399976122693151369630582021509859686872571484138250171473\
24072629169355296518425504249933896386343243011824680926507374390198\
80746028590461554831166711563651318816508625342536560750512179691849\
23107837528284805005400302901349646114818498975393171274164112155799\
08530110053411692765406112738367461296615699252667935333002905164437\
53148398448663864427246856342411592102845514711802951297508391792034\
60111721064590646242785529754780242205121896556164138494563830392939\
60737011619217510693818318143358651382782015892674906883002898189689\
01798366383306724923616475697108764481271040712064747011865770745574\
91911328046236334684906509534919762457690092242142571460642975384471\
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84383826998217749848000328783441447551816555219696241740319097472643\
69130119672855374894152132264884896634847728166582337054828635278472\
55932658811763602668639916123629576859405242428485952520728041357977\
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05748367745981854214399830125890120937889474017465029816618078694173\
02059372976858840724898861351670117742992453781530769247963611189144\
30491369608807292925745084664020804393093570982898980151606152756948\
78587450256270797420736252668018348848852442845946982753152637507026\
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33138226595600032355208568380555571103087987472826808036898458424405\
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43371569781557539513813549294929677807378669958505398606775799948899\
52764201748182621334559646601439787175695776136741414721898991423163\
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77687748361458989453763068520084729559484388831371267641615045932597\
33991401034451449082831261791514362042550047955050388269311175300173\
87345427640992333167276457329695232140185403177834302367703040311671\
59547466531209292153284251494883658766846348239940905442954561469540\
23902707136603514148057952599796260247669642466907312767400175518003\
39741620340511075098685826510229330723785175307043487202151723838884\
42587671136260240951793866980313533952923981046065485330138769265785\
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79431440958125564081018853531407691481198353738497284672952071955718\
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85020646120207801346701684923676190372548969704902467672058720513523\
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03313275841138808542466719560350017246984009485229430543494250469787\
70126710004585918726066973101441638811465132721908050221186129044333\
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15528242770168296428372846656367996383578705058874332171555021662753\
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61948440591242416588038623347806423771470609120735294553802383854619\
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14387001662383742733931116789008977124946687168791788797030161818719\
75683575303268834718381052745897542882277394675246611464486129074797\
60504648433397890880670613576136155122508099380261841541882940909908\
69300621825361869346065667208597766247932566905039138131920200192365\
10800103091170338276034739328211745474387290439235484232412221056520\
81820735484077768507126858257524816906766304395695910052417519749187\
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50482880673778980438169707294072588101420088221585654318109027009390\
03898900461279009243490655465398455237747593804952193217314475479001\
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861184358125989165959843074278314123510270888599628405165616763711450\
645147836077750895485710922325619306356970937480525098138697054265864\
979932372562756683041509114951433474465678399261911929410772580193486\
793268283909356107177851788800994483461796089445315313224139100682865\
103576448600668651416005327319903206323863325788312514218610989234088\
697553602292372344253886261775930999504890943472311408816866961170578\
230001382968695224310074277589547619250080780270608626146993148263041\
995517438017068921084460638568256606625608851741969592177316543600393\
451040868024036888096186163919893850287574691800617193851712313264825\
832551496559218729124274258921587282193413038774290581014195444514293\
669425550824910620191979765079518492009695301477854216957497064161346\
994050429837542994080131141635659303654965448627848608723623433126210\
287927338768877418848479470571233953155067269311667462816146865509227\
035999091027720412351961599977015435000183800410851973761289732225114\
808059184703908162232524260748638792215965962573647011116361962266700\
623739223825772342300061576544915529575922545497673626158610812442666\
301771388275718906372395765677274104432257507165818138891503633166845\
966377953746491413035546573608989918031580249401925789965857114253266\
962849448220612400182304244373672306156710266598140304623776124712588\
5157376
        0.75 real         0.73 user         0.00 sys
Timing sqrt.b with /usr/bin/bc
22.33830
22.3383079036
22.3383079036886766608314514
22.3383079036886766608314514388942891544207
        0.32 real         0.31 user         0.00 sys
Timing sqrt.b with openbc
22.33830
22.3383079036
22.3383079036886766608314514
22.3383079036886766608314514388942891544207
        0.15 real         0.14 user         0.00 sys
Timing sqrt1.b with /usr/bin/bc
=2E9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999\
9999999999999999999999994
1.414213562373095048801688724209698078569671875376948073176679737990\
73247846210703885038753429
1.732050807568877293527446341505872366942805253810380628055806979451\
93301690880003708114618672
1.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999\
99999999999999999999999997
2.236067977499789696409173668731276235440618359611525724270897245410\
52092563780489941441440835
2.449489742783178098197284074705891391965947480656670128432692567250\
96037745731502653985943308
2.645751311064590590501615753639260425710259183082450180368334459201\
06882323028362776039288645
2.828427124746190097603377448419396157139343750753896146353359475981\
46495692421407770077506863
2.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999\
99999999999999999999999998
3.162277660168379331998893544432718533719555139325216826857504852792\
59443863923822134424810836
        0.48 real         0.47 user         0.00 sys
Timing sqrt1.b with openbc
=2E99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999\
999999999999999999999994
1.4142135623730950488016887242096980785696718753769480731766797379907\
3247846210703885038753429
1.7320508075688772935274463415058723669428052538103806280558069794519\
3301690880003708114618672
1.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999\
9999999999999999999999997
2.2360679774997896964091736687312762354406183596115257242708972454105\
2092563780489941441440835
2.4494897427831780981972840747058913919659474806566701284326925672509\
6037745731502653985943308
2.6457513110645905905016157536392604257102591830824501803683344592010\
6882323028362776039288645
2.8284271247461900976033774484193961571393437507538961463533594759814\
6495692421407770077506863
2.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999\
9999999999999999999999998
3.1622776601683793319988935444327185337195551393252168268575048527925\
9443863923822134424810836
        0.21 real         0.20 user         0.00 sys
Timing sqrt2.b with /usr/bin/bc
70.70360669725413661247
223.38531733307809324159
706.40002831257021404187
2233.83101419959697004192
        0.88 real         0.88 user         0.00 sys
Timing sqrt2.b with openbc
70.70360669725413661247
223.38531733307809324159
706.40002831257021404187
2233.83101419959697004192
        0.46 real         0.46 user         0.00 sys
Timing fact.b with /usr/bin/bc

b=3D210928719370905123756977970752513821627856731037911012803130480975\
46901371912252063029671326032618457942014220996767041338734839636941\
28238465837596342378651047231273971014741354104414722103934729360680\
20352852990664764004296978881983964826728653112399056051035659896407\
89870386421304246032952873148754128118643333624496557581854742770993\
63718046731769197448654074369258764420623347488801209842706493684114\
95525376459406870526966979572513358780659456124082136770521849560324\
00591206196688112921699260226202293679932598100933221754761523595201\
03830009528315318765987756737932808906879497501120811593033655109650\
04015716794296957894733482407469720318736050294443462844459751369493\
30398717123392529564413442667487836826221405821181426728200366472271\
85254664684879565449427129468907774275206403216931026223811310107777\
72500835221913131855343994475181192830777747893250291983261182641296\
77352779175577437650785228104412249443739043737795292007887190468440\
69656506978108956864570510830864926123773351933096672607336972596119\
29214489957757563809741188187832598173221574138595775004478369161813\
46755167343997468237826039310082338913474950107781500343752528280799\
54585929404327065356044861514980768299045221843503149272403515680385\
06814829215904430711528874342315196416000000000000000000000000000000\
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000\
000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
        5.33 real         5.32 user         0.00 sys
Timing fact.b with openbc
dc: recursion too deep
        0.13 real         0.11 user         0.01 sys

My conclusion is that OpenBSD bc and dc are not a good replacements for GNU=
=20
versions.   This is based on runtime performance.   We haven't even begun t=
o=20
talk about POSIX compliance.   The above tests show that OpenBSD doesn't=20
comply with the POSIX output requirement that the \ in continuation numbers=
=20
is also to be counted in the line length.  So a line of a maximum of 70=20
characters, the default output line size, should have 69 digits and one \. =
 =20
OpenBSD bc has 70 digits and the \.

=2D --Phil

=2D --=20
Phil Nelson                       NetBSD: http://www.netbsd.org
e-mail: phil@cs.wwu.edu           Coda: http://www.coda.cs.cmu.edu
http://www.cs.wwu.edu/nelson=20
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