Date:        Tue, 27 Nov 2001 20:29:55 -0500 (EST)
    From:        James Chacon <jchacon@genuity.net>
    Message-ID:  <200111280129.UAA20794@gtei.net>

  | There's problems with that since the vars in question get set while you're
  | building the tools as well..

Whatever, you know much more about what is going on in there than I do.

I'd have thought it a folly to decide to use a non-existent compiler
for any purpose (including when building that compiler, to make it exist)
but, what do I know?

Note: I wasn't suggesting using the existence of the compiler to decide
whether to set USETOOLS or not, but using it to decide if you're in the
"bsd src tree" and so want to use the tools compiler (which I think is
subtly different, though perhaps not).   If there is no tools compiler,
then I'm not sure why one would ever want to use it (of course, once it
is built, then it can be used if appropriate - but perhaps that wouldn't
be the right thing to do in the middle of a pkgsrc build either).

  | Probably the better check is just to not set it if BSD_PKG_MK is set.

Not set USETOOLS?   Yes, perhaps.   Note, that until I explictly turned
it off, I hadn't even considered the tools on this system, they weren't
there, and nothing that would be able to build them was there, just the
binary sets, kernel sources, and pkgsrc.  It was only when the rest of the
sources appeared that all of this changed (only the sources, none of those
have been near any kind of build, and on this system, might never).

  | The presumption is that things within /usr/src are using the /usr/src build
  | structure.

This seems like a new presumption to me.  Until the make structure change,
the stuff that the /usr/src build structure built was the stuff listed in
/usr/src/Makefile - no more, and no less.   Anything else that happened to
be hanging about in /usr/src was ignored.

  | That may be, but the documentation for pkgsrc does clearly state that 
  | everything defaults to /usr/pkgsrc by design. Not saying it's right/wrong
  | just noting that the assumption was mostly documented.

I don't recall that one, like Luke, I think it was supposed to be able to
go anywhere, and I have certainly put it in all kinds of anywhere on systems
with different amounts of available spce.   What's more, I'm pretty sure that
something in the "how to get the sources via anon cvs" pretty much explains
how to achieve exactly the setup that I have, as while the system I experienced
this on wasn't set up that way, it is (for sources anyway) a mirror of one
that I do manage using that method, and I don't know enough about cvs to
have figured out the incantation to make it work like this by myself I don't
thing...   (it is nice though, a single "cvs update -dP" from /usr/src
updates all the standard sources, pkgsrc, and xsrc - ideal for me).

In any case, if something in some *.mk file (not in mk.conf) could be fixed
so that this setup isn't broken, then I doubt I will be the only one who is
grateful.

kre