----- Original Message -----
From: "BrownM03" <BrownM03@bigpond.com>
To: "port-vax" <port-vax@netbsd.org>
Cc: "Geoff Roberts" <geoffrob@stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au>; "Erno
Palonheimo" <esp@cc.hut.fi>; "Michael Kukat" <michael@unixiron.org>; "P.
G." <pgaray@bigfoot.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 11:23 PM
Subject: Re: VAX 4000/100 + cd + syquest ...etc



> > Careful, I have an Aunt in Tassie....;^)
> Hehe, another two-head? :)
Nah, she was born in Melbourne, but naturalised South Aussie, mind you
she's been there 30 odd years, so who knows ;^)

(Explanation to all the confused non-Aussies - There is a standing joke
that natives of Tasmania, an island state off the South
Coast of Australia, have two heads and other odd features due to
inbreeding, because of it's relatively small size and population.)

>... Hey, did you know that according to the Vic's that
> SA's are just Tasmanian's who've learnt to swim :))) hehe. jk

He he.  Ah well, maybe when they learn to play football they'll get over
it.
(Another explanation: S.A. and Victoria have a long standing rivalry
over Aussie rules football - it was invented in Victoria, but
for some reason the Vic teams get a lot of their best players from S.A.
They invented it, we perfected it.)

We are considering a sign for the Border between SA and Vic,
"You are now entering Victoria, please set your clocks back 1/2 an hour
and 100 years"
(Also a standing joke that Victoria lives in an era where the Queen
after which it was named would feel right at home.)

> > > VAX 4000-100               $5
> > Nice catch, good system. For BSD or VMS.
> I have a choice now then? hehe. Is VMS worth the effort? Or should I
just
> stick with BSD?

Well, it depends. This is a BSD list so I don't want to sound off about
VMS too much,
however since you asked ;^).  I have it on several Vax and microvax
systems, (and I use it at work)
It's somewhat Unixlike in concept, multi-user, multitasking etc, TCP/IP
is supported as an option,
(yours may not have it - possibly decnet if anything)  comp.os.vms is a
good spot and I have various
websites with (mostly) microvax info there. The VMS FAQ is brilliant and
contains lots of goodies.
(Breaking into the machine without knowing the system account (equiv to
unix 'root') password being just
one of the many useful items there.)  Vaxen often get scrapped with all
data still intact on the drives.
There is also a free hobbyist license for VMS available from DECUS if
you have a blank one, like yours.
If you are a Unix devotee you will probably find VMS a little confusing
at first, the directory syntax is a
little(?) strange at first, and there is no common 'root' on the
directory tree, rather each drive has it's own (it's not called that
though) More like DOS in that area. (though nothing much like it
otherwise.)  Good O/S though, been around a while.
Still currently in use/development, current version is 7.2 IIRC.

> ie. I don't want too many eggs (OS's) in my basket (VAX) :)) hehe
> > > [[ ps. also an HP9000 for $2 ... 3xBNC + 1xSCSI ports ...
> > Hmm, hoo yeah.  Nice.  HPUX hear you come.  (I think they run BSD
too)
> So what can I do with this? It has nothing in it apart from a RAM
module & a
> 68030!

How much ram?
The Classic Computers list would be the best bet for that one, they have
numerous HP Unix types there.

> ps. I do have a Philips 20C monitor that I MIGHT be able to hook up to
it...
> but it's 5BNC not 3... and although it may sync on green I've never
tried.

Probably RGB Vsync Hsync. Sync on green as well is possible.  HP's are
sync on green IIRC,
same as Vaxstations.  Probably won't hurt to try.

> Worth selling for $30 you think? Or is it really that good? (ie.
useable?:))]

If it works on the HP, keep it.

> > > ps. an hour ago one of my (local) mates said he'd come across a
drive
> array
> > > (rack mount) with bucket loads of drives in it (all 5pin:)))))
hehe
> > Sounds like a good idea.  Grab it if you can.
> He (and his mate) are stalling a bit. I've offered $20/drive or $100
for the
> whole thing.

Sounds like a reasonable offer, some may be dead, you don't know.

> He (his mate has the rack) only has one of the drives at present... so
I've
> (almost) got
> at least one drive (he said a RF35...which is 825MB i think). I'll
find out
> tomorrow.

That would be a start.  Hmmm. RF??  See my comments below.

> I'm told he has an offer of $500 for the whole thing...

Hmm, the right people would pay that for it, but it depends if he
actually knows them or is just
trying to beat the price up.  On top of which an RF prefix indicates a
DSSI drive, so they ARE NOT SCSI.
Digital SCSI drives have an RZ prefix. SID drives have an RA prefix.
He is almost certainly assuming they are SCSI, (hard to tell by looking)
which would explain the $500 offer.
Better enlighten him, ASAP, as DSSI was found only on Digital Vaxen and
such like, so if they don't have a Vax,
they won't be an use to them. (And may blow something up finding this
out).  And they are useful to you, or someone with
a Vax and a DSSI controller.  (Plenty will want them if you ask in the
right places.) Classic Computers for instance.
Probably here, as I suspect a few BSD'ers have DSSI based Vaxen about
the place.  You need to find out if you have a
DSSI controller in your VAX 4000.

> I'll just hope & pray that it falls through :))

I'm betting it will the moment they find out they aren't SCSI drives!

> Let me know what bits to look for and I'll keep them in mind each time
I go
> to an auction.

Most anything with a Digital logo that isn't a pc should go for next to
nothing,
drive cabinets are particularly good value, if the drives are there.
Vaxstations,
particularly VS 4000-60 or 90's are very nice. Larger Vaxen (6000's or
7000's)
are often very cheap.  If you have the room, and can move them (300Kg
plus) they
actually make a very nice system, as they are readily modifiable to
240vac single phase and
draw around 500w. (Plus drives of course).  There are caveats with
these, so if you see one
and think about getting it, drop me a line and I will fill you in on
what to look for.
Stay away from the larger RA8x series drives, they weigh in at 64kg each
and
dim the house lights when you spin them up.  (About 8 amps to spin up,
4-5 running)
If you have or obtain an SDI controller based Vax or microvax, RA7x
series drives are a
much better proposition. (House brick sized)  Come 4 to an SA70
enclosure, which
takes exactly half the space of a single RA8x, or the same space as a
single RA9x.
Ra7x capacities start at 250mb for an 70, up to 1.5Gb (I think) for a
73.
There are also RA9x series drives, which are about halfway between the
8x and 7x's
size/weight wise.  Still 240vac, but not so hungry. Weigh in around
25kg, capacities from around 1Gb up.
They are ok for home systems, though you might not want to run them H24,
they draw around 200w when spun up.
(Draw rather more than that for a few seconds as they start up).

> They're held weekly, and often have computers of various types & age.
> PLUS (for the normal auctions...) there only seem to be about 6-10
> regulars... so should be easy to find bargains.

Good hunting.  The biggest auction house in Adelaide is Evans & Clarke,
unfortunately they
flog most of their computer stuff on a Thursday evening, so you get all
the Mum/Dad & little Johnnies
there, who pay way too much for something old and crappy (through
ignorance of it's real worth) and go
home thinking they have a bargain.  Sigh.  They occasionally have a
daytime auction, I usually go to them,
and they also have daytime Office Equipment auctions which have computer
stuff in them.  Better value.
The other big place Mason, Gray & Strange has Friday daytime computer
auctions once a month on average.
They are better value, as the great unwashed don't come there that much,
so mostly dealers and the like.

While I have your attention:
I have an AS/400 I got from there for $20.  (Lacking an adapter gizmo
for the Twinax terms (got them too) though
- if anyone out there has this kind of stuff, I'd be delighted to hear
from them, IBM Part no supplied on request.)
You may email me off list if you want to talk about AS/400's....;^)

> Between Government departments being relocated interstate, system
upgrades &
> installs,  there's often some weird stuff at these auctions, and I'd
be happy to keep
> an eye out for special bits if anyone is looking for something
special/different.

> 5. Every(any)one :)
> ANY information about 4000-100 vaxen, DSSI, Q-BUS, etc... would be
handy.
> Including info on the external ports; ie. what they are and how I can
use
> them.

Likely to be plenty of serial ports, for terms, probably a line printer
port, some strange parallel thing,
Data Products?  Network, and external SCSI/DSSI ports too IIRC.

> ps. do you guys prefer short messages? :))
> (yes I'm new to mailing lists as well:)

Not me!  As long as it's (mostly) relevant.

cheers

Geoff Roberts
Computer Systems Manager
Saint Mark's College
Port Pirie,
South Australia
geoffrob@stmarks.pp.catholic.edu.au
ICQ: 1970476