Subject: Re: Incorrect information on
To: Todd Vierling <>
From: Torbjorn Granlund <>
List: port-alpha
Date: 06/16/1999 17:16:33
Todd Vierling <> writes:

  [core@ and webmaster@ are stripped; that is not an appropriate way to flame,
  as if flaming is appropriate at all!]
I am sorry you think I was flaming.  I like NetBSD and have installed and
used it for many years.  In all years I have gotten perhaps 2 crashes from
NetBSD machines.  But NetBSD 1.4 crashes during boot for the machines I have
tried.  I don't have the full picture of course, but perhaps this is
pointing to a problem.

  NetBSD 1.4 works fine on the PC164LX with SRM BIOS.  Many NetBSD developers
  use them on a regular basis.
OK, but my three alpha machines crash in the same way.  They ran NetBSD
1.3.2 and 1.3.3, and now run FreeBSD.  (Linux also tried but is no option to
us.)  I tried several versions of SRM and different configurations.

  : systems, as well as support for Macs such as the 9600.

  I can't speak for particular machines, but the macppc port is *brand new* as
  of the 1.4 release.  Though its source code has been around through the
  1.3->1.4 development cycle, this is its first public release.  It's far from
  reasonable for you to demand this kind of immediate stability when some
  machines do, in fact, work on the macppc support.  To the general public,
  the macppc port is only a couple months old.
I don't "demand" stability.  These are machines that used to run previous
versions of NetBSD (including snapshorts) but does not run the 1.4 release.

  : (My macppc install instructions are used by many people, and then I get
  : report about the install failures.)
  Now, *install* problems are a completely separate issue, and have nothing to
  do with the machines on which NetBSD itself operates.  If you would like to
  donate time to make the install system more bulletproof, please do ... we're
  doing the best we can with the manpower available.
I think you misunderstand me.  When I first installed NetBSD/macppc there
were no install instructions.  Port gury Tsubai helped me get the machines
running by answering lots of questions.  I then wrote install instructions
as a "thanks for the help".  These instructions are now linked from Tsubai's

The "install failures" are of the nature that to me indicate kernel bugs.
I.e., panics.

  : NetBSD 1.4 is the first NetBSD release I have come across that has
  : caused me any problems whatsoever.  All previous releases have worked
  : great.  But NetBSD 1.4 fails to operate at all on the systems I have
  : tried so far.
  If you'd like to cite actual problems rather than flame, please open PRs on
  exact problems.
I am sorry I made you irate.  There are PR's by me and others describing the
problems I am seeing.  They are in the "open" state.  I did not send in a
redundant PR for the macppc problems.