Subject: Re: 7 points user's memo
To: None <,>
From: =?UTF-8?B?UHJ6ZW15c8WCYXcgUGF3ZcWCY3p5aw==?= <>
List: netbsd-users
Date: 04/02/2007 09:30:51
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On Mon, 2 Apr 2007 16:10:05 +0200 (CEST)
Mark Weinem <> wrote:

> might be - but there is no "right" layout!

I should say "less convenient" layout. Pardon.

> > 2) outdated docu-pages
> Please list the outdated docs and the updates you need.
> We will then help to update them.
I recapped your words.

> > 3) weak cooperation with community
> I don't understand this: what is the community? Community of users?
> The submitters, developers and maintainers are the users! Any
> separation between NetBSD users and doers is IMHO a deception.
Maybe. But look on software project. There is a team of developers,
analysts, and managers and on the other side a user in a form of
another team of managers, workers, and computer maintainers. The two
teams have to work out common project. For users, __not for
themselves__. Do you see the division? Woild you call it deception?

> > let me say first that we ended now with no changes.
> What did you expect after only a few days of discussion?
Your experience should prompt you right answer.

> > A few days ago Jeremy C. Reed created new page in Wiki. Sporadic, ad
> > hoc activity tailored to suddenly emerging circumstations aka needs.

I got nothing against Jeremy! I only wanted to show you "a mechanism",
a habit of doing things ad hoc.

> > I can create new WWW with NetBSD contents ina few days. It's no
> > problem as I designed and created numerous WWWs (back from OS/2
> > Warp times). But what for? For personal glory?
> No, for the users of NetBSD! So please go for it and setup the "NetBSD
> Community Documentation Project". Don't wait for elections, voting
> results, "visions" or orders from official parties. Helpful ressources
> like the Wiki, the "NetBSD News Beat" or "The NetBSD CVS Digest" would
> not exist if their creators have waited for consent, votes or
> directives.
No, no, no! I'd like to do it within framework of NetBSD pages. But I'd
like first to find out "where and what". So I asked if some changes
would be possible.

> (News Beat)
> (CVS Digest)
> > 1) "WWW Team" and "Wiki Team" will be "formally" elected (with
> > common sense on mind of course :-) ) with __member names available
> > to all__.
> >
> > 2) WWW Team and Wiki Team will declare mutual help signed on highest
> > levels. :-)
> Sorry, but please stop being silly!
You're damn right serious. Didn't you feel a touch of humor?

> > 4) All hostilities between WWW and Wiki will stop immediately.
> There are no hostilities!
Wrong answer. Read the threads once more. If you are too lazy you'll
find the correct answer in netbsd-docs in my email to Andrew Ball. Of
course "hostilities" fit into the whole "7 point memo". You can read it
as "argues".

> > Links to Wiki will be placed on official WWW were needed or
> > suggested by Wiki Team (__as users know better what they want to
> > see on NetBSD WWW__).
> has already to many (and to nested) links and maybe also to
> many pages. So what comes next, all the links to news sites, digests,
> IRC channels, wikipedia articles and web forums?

You missed one point where I proposed to move some pages from NetBSD to
wiki. Once to relieve NetBSD, twice, to shore up wiki.

> Kind regards, Mark
Best regards, Przemyslaw
Przemysław Pawełczyk <>

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