Subject: Re: Organizational Changes to the NetBSD Project
To: None <>
From: Johan A.van Zanten <>
List: netbsd-users
Date: 09/02/2006 00:55:52
Matt Rolf <> wrote:

> As someone who has used NetBSD for only a year, and done no development
> on the code, I am nobody of consequence in this discussion over the
> organization of NetBSD.  At the same time, I want to see the NetBSD
> project succeed. I believe in it's development philosophy and for me it
> is the most enjoyable *nix OS to use.

Ignoring the slight difference in how long we have been using NetBSD, all
of the above applies to me as well, and i agree 100% -- i want NetBSD to
succeed, and it's my favorite OS.

> However, publicizing that the project is irrelevant in the same week
> that a person is no longer a developer betrays ulterior motives and is
> more sad than anything else.

It is sad. I was unaware that Hannum "is no longer a developer."  I can't
learn that, or about the history and veracity of people's statements if
the response is just "shut up and stop whining."

>  This thread has spawned no new ideas, no good discussion, and no real
> solutions in two days of open combat. It has exposed a petty,
> embarassing political battle to our compatriots in the Open Source
> community and to the world at large. And for what end?  The project will
> not be razed. TNF will not be plowed under and sown with
> salt. Mr. Hannum will apparently not be restored to his prior position
> of influence.

 You may be right about the ultimate outcome.  I would hope that some of
the technical issues that Hannum touched on might be addressed.  Perhaps
they will be yet.  I did want to see what the responses were going to be
to Hannum's original message.  My point is really just that the "shutup
and stop whining" responses don't help, especially when they include
unnecessary and disparaging generalizations ("why don't you sue?  Isn't it
what you americans do?").  If Garnier had simply said, "We've heard this
all a million times before in the dev lists this is just sour grapes," i
wouldn't have responded.

> In other words, his parting salvo has done plenty of damage, but no
> good.  It is much like Woody Hayes punching the Clemson player in 1978.
> As a user and advocate of the project, I am pretty disgusted by all of
> this.  If there's something that really needs to be sorted about
> revitalizing areas of the code base, then it should be taken to the tech
> mailing lists.  Trying to incite a user base revolt here and on other
> BSD message boards is a selfish and destructive way to go about things.

 Like it or not, these issues have to get resolved or they fester, and rip
the projects apart (even more).  It seems like this discussion is
happening now because these issues have never been adequately resolved.