Subject: Re: Centralized User and Password Management
To: NetBSD User's Discussion List <netbsd-users@NetBSD.ORG>
From: Tillman Hodgson <email@example.com>
Date: 11/25/2004 16:18:25
On Thu, Nov 25, 2004 at 04:50:50PM -0500, Greg A. Woods wrote:
> [ On Wednesday, November 24, 2004 at 07:51:34 (-0600), Tillman Hodgson wrote: ]
> > Subject: Re: Centralized User and Password Management
> > I tend to prefer Kerberos + NIS, with NIS run over an IPsec'd VLAN
> > (transport mode). I modify NIS maps have "krb5" or "*" in the password
> > field so that they're invalid as Kerberos will handle the
> > authentication. I use IPsec to provide secure confirmation that I'm
> > talking to the right host and that the packet hasn't been modified in
> > transit.
> Indeed NIS over some kind of private network -- over an IPsec secured
> VLAN if you want to keep your interfaces and wiring down to a minimum
> and over IPsec anyway if you don't trust your local wiring -- is
> reasonably secure. There may be weaknesses in the software
> implementations, but at least with a private network the inter-host RPC
> traffic over the network infrastructure is reasonably secure.
> If I'm not mistaken you also need to keep all your system clocks in sync
> for NIS (or Kerberos) to be trusted.... Or am I thinking of NIS+?
Kerberos. But it's only "in sync" to within a 5 minute window, and even
that is configurable in the config file.
> > This gives a traditional "feeling" system that's very easy to set up and
> > maintain (NIS) and provides both signle-sign-on and reasonable security
> > (Kerberos and IPsec).
> You should not need Kerberos for the "single-sign-on" feature if you're
> using NIS.
> Oh -- perhaps you mean that other meaning of "single sign on" -- the one
> which actually reduces your overall security unless (and even sometimes
> if) your users are extremely and consiously aware of all security issues
> at all times.
No, I mean that Kerberos uses a ticket-based system. I log "into the
network" in the morning, and am not required to enter my password again
until my ticket expires (defaults to 10 hours, just long enough to cover
a working day.
Have you worked with Kerberos at all?
For any readers who are unfamiliar with it, a gentle introduction is
http://web.mit.edu/kerberos/www/dialogue.html. It's actually quite a fun
read. I maintain have more information (links and docs I've written) at
> Regardless given all the problems and complexities with Kerberos I'd
> suggest that it should only be used in reasonably large organizations
> that can truly dedicate the resources necessary to run a proper and
> truly secure KDC and to do all the other things necessary to keep the
> entire Kerberos infrastructure running.
Here's the in-progress draft of my revised FreeBSD Handbook entry on
Kerberos5. Most of it applies directly to NetBSD:
Kerberos isn't rocket science, seriously.
I use an old SparcStation 10 running NetBSD to act as my KDC. Securing
it is dirt simple: I run no services on it other than the KDC itself and
access it through a serial console. Your slowest, oldest machine is more
than adequate to the task. A 25Mhz DECStation (ah, I miss mine) will
easily support tens of thousands of users.
Even innocents carry within them their own guilt in their own way. No one
makes it through life without paying, in one fashion or another.
- Lady Helena Atreides, her personal journals