Subject: Re: ZFS
To: None <>
From: Timo Schoeler <>
List: current-users
Date: 09/02/2006 14:00:33
thus Brett Lymn spake:
> On Sat, Sep 02, 2006 at 11:45:37AM +0200, Timo Schoeler wrote:
>> sure. i do have my opinion (here: wrt blobs).
> As you have excessively demonstrated.  Here is some news for you.
> People understand your point of view but don't agree with it.  This is
> what Bill told you too.

people in your understanding is *two* guys: bill and yourself.

>> there are dozens, if not hundreds of subscribers of the mailing list 
>> that obviously inherently agree with blobs being evil. otherwise they 
>> would respond (even if it'd be only a fraction of them, you could see 
>> some emails) to this thread.
> Ridiculous assertion.  Clearly they are silent because they agree that
> blobs can be useful and don't feel the need to enter into a
> discourse, especially with someone who has such a tenuous grasp on
> civilised discourse.

that's your personal opinion, i'm okay with that. i can, and do state, 
the same for you.

> In actual fact, you cannot legitimately claim
> silence from someone as assent nor dissent on an issue trying to do so
> is purely specious.

ever heard of psychology? ever had a glimpse into a history book? :)

> I am bemused that your behaviour is running true to my predictions.
>> the point is that mr. lymn permanently introduces wrong analogies -- WTF 
>> does gaming on Linux have to do with blobs on NetBSD? nothing.
> The issues of whether or not we should be using binary blobs is one
> that is the same across all Open Source operating systems.

yes, and there are OSs whose communities have a certain and fixed 
opinion wrt this. NetBSD does NOT.

> It is
> simpler to find examples of them in the Linux world is all.

Linux is insignificant in this discussion.

>> mr. lymn puts analogies into the thread that are just superlame and lack 
>> any meaning. i could say 'my jeans is blue', he'd respong 'wrong! in 
>> brazil the snow falls upwards, and it's warm snow!'.
> here we go again with the emotive ad hominem attacks - you cannot just
> focus on the issue, anyone who opposes you is "superlame" and/or too
> stupid to understand the issue.

hey guy, *you* do write *your* email as a human being. responding to 
*your* email is unfair to you, as you state. nobody can help you with 
this opinion, but please stop insulting :)

>> it's funny that you as a single person speaks for the whole project, 
>> even as you're developer. but there's not 'on behalf of the NetBSD team' 
>> disclaimer on your header or footer, a bit of megalomania...
> You really have no idea what goes on within the developer community of
> NetBSD or you would not be making such a ridiculous, unfounded
> accusation.

thanks to your statement above and reading between the lines in the last 
messages of this thread it turns out more and more and becomes very 
clear that exactly that 'organizational' structure of NetBSD developers, 
propaganda and handling *real* issues (like using blobs) is one very 
important thing that led to Charles M. Hannums email that made it to 
slashdot and even local IT news sites.

take a moment to think about it.

> Just to spell it out, the developers discuss such issues
> and come to a consensus as to what is the best thing to do.  Not all
> developers have to agree with the decision, there are ways to handle
> this within the community.

there are situations in life where *every* compromise means certain 
death. well, it's up to you, as a NetBSD developer.

>> who is 'we'? all the guys listed here, without exception:
> As you noted, not without exception but our community can accept
> diverse opinions on issues

see my statement above.

> - something that you appear unable to do.

you can save your polemics as they don't hit what you're aming for. try 

i'll stop beating that dead horse (NetBSD) and may it rest in peace.

dedicated statement following.

Timo Schoeler | |
RISCworks -- Perfection is a powerful message
ISP | POWER & PowerPC afficinados | Networking, Security, BSD services
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Frankie says: Relax